I am Dr. Christopher Beekman. AMA about Formative to Classic period West Mexico.

by dr_chris_beekman

My research has since graduate school revolved around issues in ancient political organization and scales of social identity (individual agency, corporate group, and ethnic identity). The sociopolitical system of the Tequila valleys, Jalisco, from ca. 1000 BC to AD 500 provides a distinctive case study in which power was shared between multiple lineages, subverting both individual identity and hierarchical power structures based on a single royal lineage. I have pursued this research through excavation at the settlements of Navajas and Llano Grande, study of the depiction of rulership in contemporary artwork, and computer simulation in collaboration with Dr. William Baden of Indiana-Purdue Fort Wayne. Dr. Verenice Heredia of the Colegio de Michoacan and I recently completed a survey of the Magdalena Lake Basin in central Jalisco that elaborates upon this research to evaluate the rise and demise of this political system.

A second research thread has been the integration of linguistic, biological, ethnohistoric, and archaeological evidence to investigate the introduction of Nahuatl speaking migrants into parts of highland Mesoamerica in the 6th century AD. A regional scale analysis identified a good degree of overlap between biology and the use of material culture, but a detailed site-specific study at Tula identified a much more complex situation in which migrants and the indigenous population used material culture to signal claims about identity and affiliation. Another study attempted a lower resolution comparison in central Jalisco, which turned out to have a strikingly different pattern of material culture. Much of this research has been in collaboration with Dr. Alec Christensen of JPAC-CILHI.

I will be here to answer your questions from 4pm to 7pm Mountain Standard Time.

dr_chris_beekman

Thanks everybody for your great questions. This was fun and I hope you had your questions answered.

best

c

Cozijo

Hi Dr. Beekman!

I was wondering why did the societies west of the Toluca valley were classified under the genetic term of “west Mexico”? Were there any early attempts to subdivide the vast area into more meaningful geographical or cultural territories? In other words, can you speak a little bit about the historiography of archaeological research in "west Mexico" and how it contributed to our understanding of Mesoamerica

bitparity

Since you specialize in scales of social identity, how often do metaphysics/ontology crop up in theories as to how identity form, especially in your particular historical era?

Like off the top of my head, I've been intrigued at the implications of Deleuze and Guatteri's ideas regarding identity as multiplicity of differences in temporary alignment, ever since I read about it in an article about the founder of Buzzfeed possibly using those theories as the basis for his company.

And while we're at it, how much of your research on identity do you believe is applicable on a wider, perhaps anthropological basis, rather than a narrow historical basis?

Artrw

What were the religious practices of the 6th Century Nahuatl-speaking migrants like, in comparison to, say, the Aztec religion immediately pre-colonialism? I imagine Huitzilopochtli hadn't emerged yet, but was Quetzalcoatl worshipped by this point?

Thanks for being here to do an AMA with us.

Celebreth

Aah! I've been waiting for this thread since we learned you were interested :) Despite my Romanophilia, I've always been fascinated with the various Mexican subcultures. I've got a few questions for you, if that would be alright!

  • Regarding the digs you've done - what's the coolest thing you've found? What was the largest dig? How does computer simulation help the job, and is it as incredible as TV shows would like us to believe? (Full reconstructions of people, cities, artwork, etc). Are there any computer simulations available to check out?

  • The depiction of rulership: I'm not sure how West Mexico relates to some of the other Mexican empires/tribes/nations, but did they share the same traits? How did their art evolve over that period of time, and how were their rulers portrayed? Were they usually shown as benevolent, more fearsome, or more deified? (If that makes sense)

  • Last one, I promise! How unique is Western Mexican civilization compared to the other Mexican civilizations?

Sorry if I overloaded the questions a bit! Thank you so much for spending time here with us today :)

EasySchmitty

What were the arts like in classic west Mexico?

Do any languages that date to your period of expertise still survive today?

Although they come from differing periods in time, did they have any influence on the later Aztec empire?

400-Rabbits

Thank you again for doing this, Dr. Beekman. I have two mildly related questions:

  1. Connections between Central Mexico and the US Southwest via West Mexico are quite established in the Postclassic. Do we see precursors to this inter-regional linkage in the Classic and earlier?

  2. How does your work relate to Dr. Jane Hill's theory of Proto-Uto-Aztecan originating in Mesoamerica and spreading northward with the expansion of maize farming, if at all (she is working in a different timeframe)?

C-JaneJohns

Is there an evolution in the Tequila Valleys sociopolitical system, during this 1500 year period, toward the shared multiple lineages or does it begin in 1000 B.C.? Also how does this society of shared leadership present its self in the archaeological record? Are there still expressions of individual identity in this culture?

Cozijo

what is the most accepted idea for the demise of the use of circular temples (Guachimontones)?

binaryatrocity

I got here late but I'd just like to say thank you for doing the AMA and I applaud you for learning and researching about my native Nahuatl culture. Keep it up and thanks for the fascinating read!

FlyLikeATachyon

What was the education system like in Classic West Mexico? What were the boys taught, what were the girls taught, and how much of a gap was there education-wise between the different genders and the social classes?

devMartel

Hello Dr Beekman,

Could you go into more depth regarding how individual identity was affected by this form of power sharing across multiple lineages? That sentence stood out to me, and I'm curious if that is in terms of a collectivist society vs. an individualistic one.

gfe98

What is the most accurate way to refer to the Tarascan/Purepecha people?

Tiako

What a wonderful opportunity this is, I speak for everyone is saying how pleased we are that you have come to answer our questions, of which I have a few:

  1. One of the perennial questions in the archaeology of the classical Mediterranean is the question of how to define urbanization, usually expressed through Weber's tripartite division of cities into consumer, producer, and mercantile. I know this is a large question, but how do you characterize the process of Maya urbanization? What forces lead to the formation of the Maya city?

  2. A popular topic of questions here are the degrees of interconnectedness in pre-Colombian America, usually expressed as whether the Aztecs and Inca traded, or whether the Maya knew about the peoples in the modern United States. Without these sorts of specifics, to what degree was their long distance trade (however you choose to define it) in the Classical Maya world? And as a matter of personal interest, how much coastal trade was there, and what were Maya boats like?

  3. There has been a lot of media attention regarding the LiDAR research in Honduras, but how surprising were these to you, and what do you feel about the media claims regarding La Ciudad Blanca?

  4. For a personal question, as a white man from the United States, how do you navigate the particular tangle of social and political issues and complicated histories regarding the research of ancient central Anerica?

Thank you very much for whichever questions you choose to answer.

Mictlantecuhtli

I'm going to throw in a few questions to open up discussion.

  • What is the distribution of guachimontones? Where are the furthest ones found? Are they built in particular places to gather resources or do they seem to be built in places that may have had an ideological or symbolic significance?

  • What is the earliest guachimonton? How far back can we trace their development? In a related vein, what is the earliest ballcourt found in the region? Can we trace from where Far Western Mexico adopted its ballcourt design from?

  • El Opeño in Michoacan has the earliest known example of a shaft tomb, yet most of the literature focuses on shaft tombs from Nayarit, Jalisco, and Colima. What happened to the shaft tomb tradition in Michoacan?

  • Pseudo-cloisonné vessels, which you mentioned in an earlier post, are known for their complex design and changes in depictions of people. Do we have an idea from where this technique comes from? Is it related to the migrations starting in the Late Classic? What is the earliest example we have of pseudo-cloisonné vessels? Is this a possible indication of early migrants before the later flood?

  • What do the Huichol and Cora think about guachimonton sites since they live in the area and in the case of the Huichol share a temple layout that is somewhat similar to a guachimonton?

  • In Etzatlan this Olmec stycle hacha was found which according to the Museo Regional de Guadalaja is the furthest Olmec object found in the west. Do you think this is a sign of direct influence from the Olmec heartland to West Mexico or rather an item of prestige that may have found its way through trade to Etzatlan?

  • Jalisco is one of the most obsidian rich areas in Mesoamerica. Has any of its varied and numbered colored obsidian types been found in other areas of Mesoamerica?

Cozijo

You mentioned that ceramics from the Aztatlan society have a tied to postclassic Mixteca-Puebla tradition, How so? why do they seem to ve a bit early?

snickeringshadow

Hey Dr. Beekman,

First, I'm very glad to see you on this AMA. I heard you talk at the SAAs and I thoroughly enjoyed it. I had a list of questions prepared, but by the time I was able to log on most of them had already been asked and answered by other users. So I'll limit myself to just one of the topics I was interested in:

I know that the Postclassic period is a bit outside of your area of expertise, but I'm absolutely fascinated by the Postclassic state of Colima. Since your background is on the Formative and Classic Periods, I was wondering if you can tell me what was going on in Colima during the Classic Period, especially following the decline of the guachimontones-building cultures. Do we see evidence of complex societies in the region during this time? And forgive me if this is too far outside of your area, but what can you tell me about the origins of the powerful polity in Colima which fought against the Tarascans in the Postclassic?

harmonygirl866

Hi Dr. Beekman!

I was wondering how you became interested in Nahuatl speakers in Mesoamerica, and specifically how you approach linguistics in an archaeological context. I am hoping to write my thesis on the effect cultural interaction in Mesoamerica had on linguistics and iconography, so I love to hear about why other people are interested in similar things. Thank you!

GenghisCannon

What do you know about long distance trade in that region? Have you seen anything from the Valley of Oaxaca?