During the medieval era in Western Europe was there anything similar to that was similar to the demes (the Blues and Greens for example) in the Easter/Byzantine Empire? Were factions like that only allowed for more prosperous people or could peasants be involved

by Thai_Hammer

I was watching a few YouTube videos that talked about the rise of Justinian and the Nika Riots along with the tense political/sports associations in the time period. It got me thinking if during the medieval period in the Western part of Europe is something like a deme would exist. Would people in Europe between the 6th century to the 15th century form social groups in a similar manner or was it just too out of bounds for people? If not around sports, were associations and politics built around anything else?

Let me know if this question makes no sense and I'll fix it?

FranzWilhelm

Can't answer your specific question but I wrote my master's thesis about the influence of the mass (as opposed to the elite) in the Athenian democracy of the 4th century BC. It's a topic that still fascinates me today as democracy is such a lively topic.

I believe that the mass had a significant influence in Athenian democracy, more so than any democracy afterwards (you'd have to define democracy at some point as even today there are various definitions).

Within the deme only people who lived close could participate in the public assemblies and only people who could afford not to work and only if they were on time as there was a limited number of people who could enter and there were all sorts of ways to keep some people out and other people in - imagine for example factions of people who physically block people's way in. Then there were all sorts of ways the orators would influence people directly and indirectly and bribes is a another matter to consider.

The problem is that of course most sources on the matter are from the elite. The common people couldn't write (nor read) so it is difficult to get a clear picture.

But one thing is for sure, only in the Athenian democracy did the masses have direct influence and not indirectly through a party or a head of state. Voting was on certain matters (referendum) not on electing someone to represent them.

A deme like was hard to run in 1 city (Athens) and impossible to run in any larger community. During the medieval period there were princes and kings and popes who ruled vast lands. They had their representatives and the people really didn't have much, if any, influence in politics.

But yes there were 'factions' namely the guilds. A guild was a social group and some tried to exert political influence. The balance between a guild and a ruler was oftentimes delicate but in the end the ruler mostly had the upper hand.

Football was also played throughout Medieval times and there were teams and fans but I know little about this. I know it was a sport for the poor and therefore I think the elite steered clear of it. I imagine it would be like the Blues and Greens but scaled down as I don't think sports were held on a scale comparable to Justinian's time and as said the elite wouldn't be interested.

There were however the jousting competitions and participants had fans but this was mostly for the privileged only and you would mostly be a 'fan' of a certain rider because of a political interest.

So in short, in Medieval times the socio-political gap between the mass and the elite would be bigger, I believe. But I would love to know more about this myself.