WW2 Bomber operational loading lists

by cockofgod

Apologies if this is too specific a question.

On an operational loading list, such as this one: http://www.457thbombgroup.org/Narratives/MA198-748th%2028%20Feb%2045001(a).jpg aircraft are identified by "ship #". Can anyone tell me if this matches up somehow to a plane serial number or a good resource to determine what aircraft this would match to? I have particular interest in the crew listed as ship #785 and am trying to ID the plane.

the_howling_cow

The "Ship #" does indeed match up to the last three numbers of the plane's serial number. Using the resources listed below, I've determined with all likelihood that the plane you seek is B-17G-70-BO 43-37785, nicknamed "TARFU" (Things Are Really Fucked Up) for a piece of period armed forces slang.

This B-17G was built in the spring of 1944 at Boeing and was delivered to the Cheyenne air depot (Cheyenne, WY) on May 12, 1944. It then flew to Hunter Army Airfield in Georgia on June 1, 1944. She was then flown to Grenier Army Airfield in New Hampshire on June 13th, 1944 to prep for her transatlantic flight. The B-17 made the trip successfully and was then assigned to the 748th Bombardment Squadron, 457th Bombardment Group (Heavy) at Glatton, England on June 17, 1944 and began combat operations soon after.

After its successful year of war service (I count 40+ mission symbols) 43-37785 was returned to the United States via Connecticut on June 8th, 1945. It was flown to Texas, and then sent to Kingman, Arizona where it was broken up for scrap metal at the aircraft recycling facility there on November 29, 1945.

Here are some color illustrations and period photos of what the plane looked like during its combat service

http://imgur.com/r9HI8AF

http://imgur.com/U8uQfdq (Note the last three numbers of the plane's serial are repeated several times, probably for easier identification)

http://imgur.com/4iIwk5c

http://imgur.com/hzqbIXX

http://imgur.com/7Pe8IJD

The 457th Bomb Group did not use the common two-letter or letter-and-number squadron codes for its planes, instead using colored propeller bosses to denote the squadrons.

  • 748th BS - red prop boss
  • 749th BS - blue prop boss
  • 750th BS - white prop boss
  • 751st BS - yellow prop boss

43-37785 has red propeller bosses, indicating it belonged to the 748th BS which is supported by your document.

Within each squadron, each individual plane was identified using a letter. 43-37785's was "B". If there had been a runover of letters (more than 26 aircraft in the squadron) and there were two planes using the "B", the second one would be marked "BB" or "B_" (read B-bar)

According to the list of planes provided on the 457th BG web site, there was another B-17's serial with the last three numbers "785"; B-17G-80-VE 44-8785, call letter "Y", that belonged to an unknown squadron of the 457th. This plane was a Pathfinder ship with an H2X radar (nicknamed "Mickey") in place of the ball turret.

This would show on the plane's crew list with "BT" (for ball turret gunner) being replaced with "MN" for "Mickey Navigator." Since your "785" does not have an "MN" in its crew list, it is therefore not 44-8785, and must be 43-37785.

The crew list for a normal B-17 at this time in the war (February 1945) is as follows. Note that there is only one waist gunner; due to the reduced threat from German fighters from the summer of 1944 on, one waist gunner was eliminated. He is now denoted by just "WG" instead of "LWG" and "RWG." In the very last days of the war (April 1945), B-17s sometimes flew with no waist gunners at all.

  • P: Pilot

  • CP: Copilot

  • N: Navigator

  • TOG: Togglier

  • TT: Top turret gunner

  • RO: Radio operator

  • WG: Waist gunner

  • BT: Ball turret gunner

  • TG: Tail gunner

Here is the crew list for a "Mickey" B-17. Note the ball turret gunner is absent, replaced with the H2X operator "MN". There was often a second navigator to help work the Mickey set. At this point in the war only Pathfinder planes had dedicated bombardiers; the Mickey-equipped planes led the whole squadron or group and dropped their bombs first, aiming with the bombsight. The toggliers on the following "normal" B-17s simply flipped the switch to drop their bombs when they saw the leader had dropped; the toggliers did not sight with a bombsight.

  • P: Pilot

  • CP: Copilot

  • N: Navigator

  • N: Second Navigator/Mickey assistant

  • MN: Mickey operator

  • B: Bombardier

  • TT: Top turret gunner

  • RO: Radio operator

  • WG: Waist gunner

  • TG: Tail gunner

Sources:

History of B-17 43-37785

http://www.americanairmuseum.com/aircraft/11791

List of all B-17s and their fates

http://www.avialogs.com/index.php?option=com_phocadownload&view=category&download=15779&id=1490

B-17 Serial Numbers

https://100thbg.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=180:b-17-serial-numbers&catid=25&Itemid=581

457th BG assigned aircraft

http://www.457thbombgroup.org/Fate/RL06.HTML

8th Air Force Bomb Group markings

http://www.303rdbg.com/8af-markings.html