Is it possible to complete a Ph.D. in History (with a B.A. in a technical field) while also serving active duty in the military?

by Gof_

Hey guys, I'm not really sure if this is the appropriate place to post this, but currently I am studying Naval Architecture, and will be commissioning into the military after the completion of that degree. However, I have an absolute fascination with history. I was wondering if anyone had any experience themselves, or with a colleague, who managed to complete a Ph.D. without an undergrad in history, while also serving in the military?

015181510

Sure is.

There are two active duty army officers in the PhD program at my university right now. One of them actually defended recently, after having been pulled away for two years for an overseas assignment.

I should note, however, that in both cases, the military wanted these officers to get the PhD, so that probably had a lot to do with it. They were both technically stationed at the university and the university was their point of assembly should they be mobilized. I don't know any more detail than that, as they are both American history students and I'm in a different cohort, but the long and short of it is that it is definitely possible.

It's also possible to get into a graduate program without an undergrad degree in the same field, although in some cases there are remedial graduate level courses that are required. That varies by university though. The college where I got my MA offered such courses, but the university where I got my PhD and the one I currently work at do not offer such courses. So it all depends.

I would look into a school near DC. There are tons of Pentagon officers who go to places like George Mason University for graduate school while serving active duty at the Pentagon. That's one of the strong points of that particular graduate program. I believe UM College Park is very similar.

nopeDC

Might be worth asking/cross posting in r/Military. I knew people that completed their bachelors and masters in uniform while still working their duty position, but not PhDs that I can recall.

textandtrowel

As an active duty officer, you'll generally be far too busy to pursue a graduate degree through casual study. However, if you stick around to reach O3 grade, opportunities will open up, particularly for MA studies.

In the Army, this usually happens after you've done all the things a Captain (O3) needs to do for promotion. Typically that's a year of Army schools and a year of command time, and then several years doing odd jobs waiting for promotion to Major (O4). During this limbo time, most Army Captains spend a lot of time on staff, but the military likes it's field grade officers to have graduate degrees whenever possible.

In preparation for that, many Army Captains get called on to (1) teach at the Academies—mostly West Point, but also Annapolis, etc., (2) teach ROTC at universities across the country, and (3) leave the operational Army and pursue a functional area (e.g. becoming a FAO). Each of these programs can have masters studies built into them. Officers who go different routes often end up at the Command and General Staff College, which is also a graduate-level program.

Many officers, particularly those selected for Academy assignments, get their MA degrees, relocate to the Academy, and then complete PhD dissertations while teaching. This is actually more efficient than most civilian PhDs, who (1) get an MA and pay for it, (2) get accepted into a PhD program, (3) do a second round of MA work while teaching, and (4) design, research, and write their PhD while teaching, scouring the job market, and trying to craft themselves into competitive candidates. As such, US civilians typically spend five or more years on their dissertations, whereas service members probably won't finish if they can't complete their PhD while on their three-year teaching assignment. Career officers who don't complete a PhD at this stage will often pursue one after reaching Colonel (O6) before promotion to a General grades (O7+).

I'd imagine that the naval career paths are very similar in broad brush, and that they're probably pegged to the same grades (i.e. reaching O3 opens doors). You'll want to talk with your officer in charge to get a better feel for opportunities available at present and how those opportunities are likely to change in the next few years.

Note that if you're working on an ROTC scholarship or studying at USNA, you won't start accruing GI Bill benefits until several years after graduation. However, if you stay on past your initial commitment, you'll begin accruing benefits that you can apply to graduate studies. Again, your OIC can help you here. As with all things, be sure to read the fine print, and know that the needs of the Navy might not always seem convenient to your career aspirations.

After commissioning as a naval officer, I'd strongly recommend setting a few personal goals that will make you competitive for history assignments or, if you leave the military, transitioning into grad school. In particular, I'd recommend trying to read at least one non-fiction book each month, shooting for at least six academic histories a year. And if you can swing it, work on languages and expose yourself to as much international travel as possible. Languages are a big hurdle for many grad student historians, and the more diverse your experiences, the more you'll bring to the table once you start grad studies.

And of course: Thank you for your service.

3moose1

Yes.

I was a Marine and earned my B.S. and worked towards my masters on active duty. A coworker earned his BS, MBA, and his JD (law degree) on active duty.

The kicker is tuition assistance will not pay for doctoral degrees, so you will need to use your GI bill if your program isn’t funded.

It’s hard as fuck, but it’s possible.

For what it’s worth, my advice is to wait until you’re out to go for any doctoral degrees. The housing allowance you have from the post 9/11 GI bill is a lifesaver in grad school.

For example, I’m in law school and having my BAH takes 4000% of my stress away, allows me to take prestigious (yet unpaid) internships, and study abroad this summer.

None of that would be possible if I had to worry about paying my mortgage.

DBHT14

Depends, I know a guy who did it while I was still an undergraduate at Virginia Tech.

But he was also a Colonel on his way out and XO of the AROTC unit with two Masters two his name already all in related fields. I assume you are commissioning through ROTC vs NUPOC or applying to OCS?

Maybe ask around some of the officers at your unit and see who are taking courses while there to get an idea of what the experience is like.

It's certainly an option after seeing it myself but you may need to figure out how to make the leap from STEM to History, if you have the ability maybe try picking up a minor to start?

kirksan

My brother-in-law got his masters in military history while active duty in the army. He already had his bachelors when he joined up, he spent about a decade doing regular army stuff, after that he got into a program where the army paid the tuition for him to complete his masters at Ohio State. After he got his degree they sent him to West Point where he taught military history for a few years. Pretty good deal for everyone involved.

ass_cash253

It's possible to get a bachelors or even a masters, depending on what your active duty job is it can be a lot harder or easier. Never heard of anyone completing a PHD though

2lisimst

Depending on your community - if you're in SWO, subs, Aviator it will be tremendously difficult.

GdanskBoy

I have a buddy who was in the Navy that wanted to get a PHD in military history. I lost touch with him, but if that is your passion you should absolutely use the government aid and resources at your disposal to get a PHD, even if you have to wait until your service ends. One of my favorite historians, Gwynne Dyer, had a military background from Canada. I think you need to get a bachelor's degree in History before you can get a master's or PHD though. Sorry if this post is useless and doesn't answer your question. Good luck dude! I hope you write a good history book one day!

pwnslinger

Why do you want to get a PhD in history?

That's (the history variant of) the question I ask every student that tells me they want to go into a doctoral program. If you just really like history, a PhD will be a waste of your time and money. If you have decided you want your future career to be professor of history at a university, then a PhD is warranted.

Figure out what job you want and what level of education it requires. Believe me, getting a PhD is an endeavor one should not undertake lightly.

Ataturk20

I would just go for your masters first (its required). I would say do an online program first. Then once youre out of the military do a PhD. When i was in my program i was working 60-70 hours weeks trying to read 3 textbooks in history a week plus writing 2 papers a week. This didnt account for our final paper as well, and I was not even in the military. I got about 3-4 hours a sleep a night, and finally i started using drugs. I learned to hate history and everything I was studying because I was drowning in it. I ended up attempting suicide because i couldnt handle it. I am completely clean now and not suicidal. I left the program and found an online program that I can manage with relative ease. I love what I study now and will be teaching at a high school in the next couple of years. I will say my major professor was borderline sociopathic, but do not jump into a PhD program without knowing what is expected of you. It ruined me for a short time.