If you ordered a whiskey from a saloon back in the old west, like in Tombstone or Deadwood in the ~1870's, what was the likely origin and quality of what you'd be drinking?

by 766AP

Would it have been bottled over in Kentucky, and shipped all that way by train and covered wagon?

Would it have aged in an oak barrel? If so, for how long? Or would it have been something more like a moonshine, made more locally?

Is there anything currently on the market that would compare to it, or was it likely such rot-gut shit that it wouldn't even be legal by today's standards?

And how about 'the good stuff' that a saloon keeper might keep hidden behind the bar for those who could afford it... How good would their 'top shelf' whiskey have been? Anything on the market today that might compare?

(I remember a scene in the show Deadwood - which was well researched - where a VIP high-roller preferred Basil Hayden's, and they we able to get it specially for him. But today's Basil Hayden's is apparently not the same as it was then. Maybe the Basil's of that time was more like today's Old Grand Dad?)

Any historians here? Would love to hear more about those old-timey cowboy whiskies out on the frontier.

itsallfolklore

Even before the transcontinental railroad (1869), the West was connected with the international marketplace. Products from all over the world were available, although clearly, it took a bit longer for the supply lines to reach newly-founded and/or remote settlements. Primary sources attest to how quickly whiskey and beer arrived, however. J. Ross Browne in his "Peep at Washoe" described the newly-established Comstock Mining District (Virginia City, in particular), less than a year after the first strike in June 1859. While trekking across the Sierra in the early spring of 1860 - as soon as the snow storms allowed - he was accompanied by merchants who set up saloons in tents to sell imported products.

In addition, archaeological excavations of four Virginia City saloons (1993-2000) revealed a wide array of products from the Eastern States and from Europe. These included ale from Britain and mineral water from German states. There was even a carbon water filter imported from London (1863). We even found what appears to be the oldest Tabasco Pepper Sauce bottle with the company's imprint, brought from Louisiana around 1870.

These items stray from your core answer, but they give you a picture of the mercantile tentacles that stretched throughout the world. The mining West produced wealth, and entrepreneurs quickly offered the finest products for sale - often at inflated rates because of the remoteness of many of these mining towns.

Among the remains found in the saloons, we found a gin bottle imported from England, and we found a wide array of brown bottles without embossing, but which appeared to have held whiskey. Paper labels were rarely preserved, and I can't recall any whiskey labels in the entire collection of 310,000 artifacts that we found, cleaned, cataloged, and analyzed.

Parallel research revealed that a great deal of whiskey was brought in from eastern distilleries - so you could expect to find Kentucky bourbons at most saloons. I imagine there was a fair amount of Scotch coming in from the UK - and perhaps some Bushmills - but we did not find clear evidence of that in the archaeological record (references to Scotch do exist in reports of Scottish celebrations). Whiskey and other hard liquors were easily transported, so their importation from elsewhere was something that was consistently done. This contrasts with beer, which is produced (and consumed) in larger volumes, so local breweries tended to provide most of these (acknowledging the hundreds of cream-colored Glasgow ale bottles that we found at each of the sites).

I am not an authority on the history of whiskey production (although I have done a fair amount of research into the subject through consumption!!!). I do not know how production differed in the nineteenth century, but I can tell you that even today, the older distilleries take a lot of pride in maintaining antique equipment and traditional approaches to production. I expect that we would not be startled by a lack of quality in an average saloon. There were some really disgusting bars (just like today), and if you get in a time machine, I recommend you avoid those places - their whiskey may be questionable. Raunchier places were more likely to cut whiskey with water to extend the product.

With regard to quality, Western towns frequently differentiated between higher and lower-grade saloons. Virginia City and neighboring Gold Hill, for example, had nearly one hundred "one-bit" saloons - places where a whiskey, a beer, or a cigar could be purchased for 12 1/2 cents. There were also a dozen or so "two bit" saloons where similar products could be had for a quarter, and there was an assumption that there would be a similar increase in the quality of the product: Comstock journalist William Wright - writing as Dan De Quille - told a story about a man who went into a two-but saloon and ordered a whiskey. After drinking it, he placed a dime (which would have been known as a short bit) on the counter. The bartender said, "Excuse me, sir, but this is a two-bit saloon." The man answered, "That was my understanding when I walked in, but after drinking your whiskey, I assumed this was a one-bit saloon." I suspect this account was folklore, but it carries a message that transcends the question about whether it was true or not - namely that there was an expectation that better saloons carried better whiskey.

In partial answer of the question posed by /u/nalc, saloons attempted to differentiate themselves from competitors by offering unique products, and these include - as indicated by advertisements - specialty cocktails (mixed drinks were becoming very popular by the mid nineteenth century) and an array of liquors - which is usually how they advertised their wares. There was always an effort to bring in something different. At the same time, the array of saloons were each drawing from the same supply line, so one would expect to find many of the same products at each saloon.

edited to add a photo of the gin bottle because we can't overlook gin!!!

edited X2: thanks for the silver (but after all of this I wanted a drink!!!).

edited X3: thanks for the gold (I owe you a drink!!!).

edited X4 I have deleted a reference to watered-down whiskey becoming bad to drink since this is creating too much of a distraction.

nalc

Add-on question: were there different brands of liquor back then, i.e. that you'd be able to order the same liquor from multiple saloons? Or would each saloon source their liquor independently and just sell it as generic house whiskey or whatever?

Philosopher_King

A similar /r/AskHistorians post from 4 years ago: What else did people drink in "wild west" saloons?

Some great answers by /u/itsallfolklore and /u/Wades-in-the-Water. With this tantalizing intro:

I was part of a team that excavated four saloons sites that operated in Virginia City, Nevada between 1863 and roughly 1885.

And excavation pic.

Searocksandtrees

Hi, this question sounds like a job for our hero of the Old West, /u/itsallfolklore. While you're waiting, check out their previous answers on saloon drinks, prices, and more here

GuruBushHippie

I have a few additional questions if anyone can answer them.

  1. is it true that bartenders in the old west would mix tobacco into whiskey?

  2. is it true that the origin of a “shot” was trading a bullet for a swill of liquor?

  3. there’s a little old west town called Dunton Colorado that’s a private resort now. I did some work there and they claim to have the real carved monikers of Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid. I’ve seen these carvings, but because they’re not signatures they can’t be truly authenticated. Can anyone place the two of them in southwest Colorado together? If those carvings are real it’s pretty insane to have touched them.