[META] About how long ago did this sub start becoming heavily moderated?

by LuminousDreams

I just wanted to first say this sub is a gold mine of great info. And I have recently began searching it for answers to questions I have had and I've found other mods talking about the "un moderated past" and how some old answers may not be as reliable and to report them to mods if you find them.

How long ago are we looking at? I've found answers to questions from 8 years ago that I've found helpful but don't know if they're 100% true.

And sorry mods I would have used modmail but i just wanted to post so everyone would know going forward.

crrpit

There are a couple of interesting accounts of AH early history by u/eternalkerri (here) and u/agentdcf (here) that sketch out the rather chaotic origins of the sub and the evolution of a strict moderation culture, a shift which they both date to c. 2012. However, the acceptance of a need for strict moderation doesn't quite translate into an immediate shift in sub culture towards the kind of answers we expect (and get) today - those norms evolved more slowly. My personal rule of thumb is that an answer older than 4-5 years is less likely to meet our current standards. That doesn't mean they're useless or actively wrong, just that the bar for what we consider to be good has risen considerably over time. Even then it's uneven though - there's some really great, high-effort content from the early days that very much still stands up to current standards.

Edit: if you're here because you're interested in the history of the sub, can we also interest you in its future? This autumn we'll be hosting our second digital conference here on Reddit, and we're looking for the community to get involved - check out the announcement thread here!

nonbog

I just want to take this opportunity to thank the mods. This sub-reddit is incredible.

DanKensington

I've found answers to questions from 8 years ago that I've found helpful but don't know if they're 100% true.

As the mod with the least history qualifications and the highest likelihood of encountering bad old stuff in my daily goings-about - and the need to assess such old stuff because I'm an FAQ Finder - I feel this pretty hard. Generally speaking, my assessment of answers, both whilst modding and FAQ finding, goes as follows:

1. Did OP Deliver? That is, how chunky is the answer, how much detail and coverage is in it? Of course, how much of a chonk an answer should be depends on the topic, but just like now, you can usually dismiss out of hand any answers that are too short. Basically, if you can genuinely say in some form, "Dang, OP delivered", that passes this count.
2. Is There Sauce? Even today, sources are not automatically required, so in any AH era, any answer that's unsourced is not necessarily bad. However, if OP did include sauce, that's automatically a higher estimation from me. With a caveat...
2a. What Kind Of Sauce Is It? Just because it is sauce does not mean it is good sauce! See if OP says what the work is. Is it a novel? Dismiss it. (You'd be surprised how many people think historical fiction is an acceptable citation.) Is it an academic work? Better footing. And don't forget to check who wrote it. Some authors you can dismiss out of hand if someone cites them.
3. Is OP Flaired? A lot of flairs have been around a long time and some are still around from the early days, when the bar for flair was a lot lower. Again, this isn't an automatic marker of quality, and some who were previously flaired have since lost it, but if someone does bear a discrete topic flair or is an Inactive Flair, that's generally a good sign. (Inactive Flair is a fairly recent addition, so older users who have since lost flair don't have it.)

There's a few more qualifications I can't quite put into words right now, though one generally acquires that sense after spending enough time here - a few weeks of binging the Sunday Digest should be enough to show you what a good answer looks like.

Personally, I define the Dark Ages as being 2012-2013, so any answer from that era should be treated with maximum caution. Anecdotal evidence from other mods appears to confirm this impression. My default timeframe in Camas Search only goes back to 2014 January 1. From 2015 and onwards (and thus in line with u/crrpit's rule of thumb as above), our famous moderation is firmly in place and you should see much fewer bad posts.

BrowseDontPost

The problem I experience with the current moderation is that it seems very few questions are actually answered. I just see a seemingly endless stream of questions with no allowable responses. The worst part is it is often difficult to see what questions have been answered. I see that some questions have comments, but upon opening the thread, find the comments didn’t meet the criteria to be left up. It is really frustrating.

Confucius3000

Hey, not to sound petty or anything, but are there any initiatives to diversify the mod pool?

I feel like questions regarding non-USA/Europe/East Asia subjects are less likely to be answered. At least, my questions regarding latin-american history haven't met much success.

Unless I have very niche interests and don't ask very enticing questions, hehe

kowabungo

I am also interested to learn about a few related questions:

  1. What is the governance process (if any) by which these changes takes place. (How) was it formalized?
  2. It seems to me that first there was a cultural expectation established on the sub, and that as it grew the rules of moderation became more formalized, applied, and specific. Is this the case? How was such a culture established? And to what extent does that culture still play a role (alongside moderation, rules, protocol) in shaping the type of content that is posted here?
  3. This sub has, in my opinion, high quality content. Does this boil down to moderation or culture (like mentioned above), or is there also something else (or more specific) that is key to maintaining the quality?
semi-bro

We're not allowed to answer that because it was less than 20 years ago

supremevanya

Sorry, this question breaks rule 2: nothing less than 20 years old.

MalleBeer

As a history student, I fucking love this subreddit. I’m very passionate about history and this subreddit, to me, is the embodiment of what the internet should be: quality information

Besides cute cat videos of course

Nabe8

Thank you for the best moderated subreddit of which I know. It really makes a difference, especially given the topic and purpose. =)

yourmotherisepic

Just want to drop a quick thank you whilst I can to everyone who provides insightful answers, it genuinely is a shining light in the dark on Reddit. I appreciate all the hard work that goes into long answers.

Hopefully I’ll be able to give back to the community in the form of my own answers soon!

SuperNintendad

I find myself wishing other subs were as heavily moderated. Especially r/askscience

YazzleMcRazzleDazzle

This is my favorite subreddit and community online, by a mile. Thank you moderators.

vidoeiro

As a sidebar a mod once told me you should have no problems reporting a years old comment that gets linked that is not up to spec now.

kamarguments

Loving this post and the deep engagement by the mod team. I was vocally describing this sub to a pal IRL who is a regular redditor but not on it and she was shocked that the post/response system was so complicated, but deeply impressed at the quality of answers. It’s a great thing and understandably always in flux, and we’re all the richer for it. Thank you

i5ucked

How to as questions on this sub? I could never get it to work. Can someone please explain?

MrPrettyKitty

Ok, seems to be ask a question day. How does that RemindMe bot work? I see great questions without answers and would love to check them out later. I click on the link and it takes me to the same page I was viewing. iOS user.

CFSCFjr

Has anyone ever proposed an "Answered" tag to posts so people know when a quality answer is in before they click?

Georgy_K_Zhukov

Hello and welcome to this /r/AskHistorians META thread! As with any thread about the rules and standards, I know some people will be here to express frustration at never seeing any answered questions. Some questions do get one, some don't, but it often takes patience, and we do a lot of work to try and improve the ways to consume content on the subreddit. Our newest is The AskHistorians Newsletter! This is a once-per-week mass-mailer we send out with highlights of content from the past week. Check out the linked thread for more info., or...

#If you already like the sound of that, click here to subscribe to it.

[deleted]

Every post I see on this sub has 0 answers lol

nobody2765

Wow. People actuallt getting to commdnt

[deleted]

I kind of wish that instead of deleting imperfect answers we archive them in case someone wants to attempt further research that better falls in line with the rules here

Dyldor

It took the piss when I followed your sub yesterday, and a thread I really wanted to view apparently had 72 comments in the answers, and not a single one was visible.

There is a line, you could at least let it stand for a few hours until it’s proven incorrect to entertain people’s curiosity - with a relevant disclaimer

mule_roany_mare

I enjoy this sub, but rarely.

Most often I regret clicking as the question whets my appetite & the comment graveyard takes it away. There is an easy solution, a bot which states the current moderation policy for the thread, but allows anecdote, further questions, jokes, personal theories, tangents , folklore, good but not great answers, & the devils advocate in replies below that comment. Like it or not there is value in much that doesn't meet mod standards or preferences.

Even better the few exceptions you do allow won't have to be mixed in and dilute the top level comments. You could even use css to make the dregs of the crop thread black text on black background, or white text on white background, or pink on purple to punish people like me who are turned off by current policy.

Too often there is nothing when there used to be good responses & discussion. Too often this sub is historians talking to historians

RecklesFlam1ngo

edit: Is downvoting comments like mine normal?

The downside of heavy moderation is that almost every post I see never gets answered properly, if at all.

It also sucks not really being able to comment at all because I'm no historian that is well-endowed with knowledge, nor can I write an "educated" answer (or question) anyway because to be honest I can barely remember facts and tidbits coherently :)

Most of time it'll be a wave of [deleted by moderator] and the likes, but unfortunately I suppose it's necessary to maintain a high quality subreddit despite being annoying seeing 3-10 posts in a row with either no comments or it's hard to see which posts have been even answered decently.

(To be fair, the questions aren't always formulated in a manner that explodes with quality)

Semenrecycler

Wow, so it’s not enough to make every other current-day thread a comment graveyard? They actually want to purge answers from the past too? Usually when I search this sub for certain topics, the only threads that have answers are the ones from that time period before the crazy strict moderation began. They may not have met the standards of the current mods here. But they were helpful, and provided at least some of the info I was looking for (that I independently verified), which is all I care about.

Now it seems like anyone who doesn’t have a fucking PhD gets their comments deleted immediately, regardless of their accuracy.

swampcastle

I will say that I wish the sub would allow short comments that are jokes but mostly appreciate the high standards that this sub requires for posting