How did post-NAZI Germany undo what I've always read was incredibly effective propoganda?

I've just finished watching Man In The High Castle and it has prompted this question.

SPOILER ALERT

One of the main characters young daughter intensely repeated and believed the propaganda learned at school and general NAZI society. Towards the end her own mother exclaimed that "her brain belongs to the state". MAJOR SPOILER ALERT In the last episode, the the leader of NAZI America takes off NAZI medals, as if to suggest that the US would be leaving the NAZI empire. I was left wondering how the young child and her peers would have had their intense propaganda education undone, and how the society would progress when they were adults if they couldn't undo those views.

Whenever it was covered in my history class, we were taught that one of the NAZI's strongest skills was their propaganda abilities and how well they educated the youth in particular to truly believe in what they were doing. To my understanding a lot of adults were more along the lines of simply going along with it to keep themselves safe.

So given that the NAZIs did so well with creating these beliefs and sentiments in the young population of the time, how did post-NAZI Germany "re-educate" the population? Was there an official tactic or was it just something that occurred naturally? I am assuming it worked relatively well as otherwise there'd be a whole load of people in their 80's with intensely bigoted views, which as far as I know isn't the case. Looking back from our modern day perspective, do historians generally consider the re-education efforts to have went well?

If any of my assumptions or understanding that I have stated is wrong please let me know, as I've said this is just from a basic school level understanding and general knowledge.

Also I just want to be explicitly clear that I am not praising what NAZI propaganda said or taught, simply that to my understanding they were incredibly effective in teaching their beliefs.

1 Answers 2020-09-10

Did Charles Martel really "saved" the western European Christianity when he defeated the Umayyads in the Battle of Tours/Poitiers?

There's been a lot of controversy in this. Some historians say that the aftermath of the battle wasn't "that important", but some others say that he "saved" Europe Christianity.

2 Answers 2020-09-10

Thursday Reading & Recommendations | September 10, 2020

Previous weeks!

Thursday Reading and Recommendations is intended as bookish free-for-all, for the discussion and recommendation of all books historical, or tangentially so. Suggested topics include, but are by no means limited to:

  • Asking for book recommendations on specific topics or periods of history

  • Newly published books and articles you're dying to read

  • Recent book releases, old book reviews, reading recommendations, or just talking about what you're reading now

  • Historiographical discussions, debates, and disputes

  • ...And so on!

Regular participants in the Thursday threads should just keep doing what they've been doing; newcomers should take notice that this thread is meant for open discussion of history and books, not just anything you like -- we'll have a thread on Friday for that, as usual.

18 Answers 2020-09-10

AMA: Martha S. Jones, author of “Vanguard: How Black Women Broke Barriers, Won the Vote, and Insisted on Equality for All" (Sept. 10 at 12 PM ET)

Hi, I’m Martha S. Jones, author of Vanguard: How Black Women Broke Barriers, Won the Vote, and Insisted on Equality for All. I am a professor of history at Johns Hopkins University, where I teach courses on race and the law, Black womanhood, and the history of women and the vote.

Vanguard argues that Black women have been the vanguards of democracy – since the earliest days of the republic in movements for women’s rights and abolitionism. While many women celebrated the centennial of the 19th Amendment, I wrote about the disappointments of the 19th Amendment and how Black women were left behind to fight for several more decades against the disenfranchisement of Jim Crow laws. In my story, the 19th Amendment was a beginning, not an end, for Black women. In the 20th century, the women of Vanguard, including Fannie Lou Hamer and Shirley Chisholm, continued the work of voting rights into the civil rights movement and beyond. Today, leaders like Stacey Abrams and Kamala Harris carry this torch, and by their examples, make the case that neither racism not sexism has a place in American politics.

Thank you to the /r/AskHistorians mods for welcoming me for this community conversation. Ask Me Anything! 

EDIT at 3 PM ET: I have to wrap things up, but it was so lovely hearing from you all and answering your questions. If you'd like to attend a Vanguard book talk, I'll be speaking in more detail on Friday night at 7 PM ET with New York Times editor Brent Staples virtually via Books are Magic Bookstore in Brooklyn. Thanks all!

14 Answers 2020-09-10

In European aristocratic and genteel tradition, "working with one's hands" was a sure sign of low status. By what reasoning did aristocratic practices like making war, helping a monarch dress, or aiding a monarch in their ablutions did not qualify as "working with one's hands?"

I hope this question makes sense. I'm basing it off of a few loosely connected observations. One is that gentlemen, and certainly aristocrats, traditionally do not "work with their hands," a common theme in historical documents and literature. The other is that, as I understand, European aristocrats in the medieval era and beyond defined themselves in part through making war and leading men into battle. The third is an argument made by Benjamin Wooley in his book on Jamestowne, Savage Kingdom, that the common narrative of early Jamestown settlers being "gentleman" and therefore unsuited to and uninterested in manual labor is untrue because most of the "gentleman" had experience with manual labor through their participation in warfare. And finally, there's the position of "groom of the stool" in early modern England - a high ranking position that ostensibly invoklved aiding the king in his ablutions and eliminations - or the privileged position of helping Bourbon Kings dress in 18th century France. These positions and duties seem very manual, and servile beyond polite professions of servility in inter-elite interactions. Yet they were apparently quite privileged and high status positions!

So were there exceptions where working with one's hands was excusable or even evidence of high status? Or did the definition of manual labor contain enough flexibility to easily factor in these seeming contradictions? Or is my entire premise wrong, roote din stereotype and cliche? Thanks!

1 Answers 2020-09-10

Possible reasons for a 13th-century etymological link between Dutch and Lithuanian?

Today I looked up the Dutch word 'belijden' (to confess) in a dictionary. There it said that the word is first attested in the 13th century (1282) and that it is related etymologically to the Lithuanian word 'klykti' (to scream). This is a well-respected dictionary (Van Dale), so I trust that this etymology is reliable.

Now I started wondering how there could be an etymological link between Duch and Lithuanian on such a word dating from the 13th century or before. I'm unsure about the direction, but usually, such indications in the dictionary mean that the Dutch word is derived etymologically from the foreign word.

Is there any significant interaction between the Middle Dutch-speaking low countries and the Lithuanian-speaking baltic around this time that would explain such a link? The word is used nowadays in a predominantly religious setting, yet I suspect the eastern schisma means that there likely was no close religious interaction between both regions? Was there maybe trading interaction between both on the baltic sea and north sea?

Any conjectures from the medievalists among you?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

The acceptance of atomic theory in science (is my narrative correct?)

As far as I can tell, there was no serious objection to Dalton's atomic theory in the sense that there was no competing theory going around. Rather, some scientists cautioned that the evidence for atoms was all indirect, and the believer might have been taken in by an illusion.

In the 19th century there were two forms of evidence for the existence of atoms and molecules. The first was the kinetic theory of gases, which mathematically modelled the behavior of gases (pressure, temperature, diffusion, etc.) on the assumption that gases are made of particles. The second was Dalton's law of multiple proportions: chemical substances combined and broke down by weight in ratios of small integers. For a good century this was all there was. Then in the early 20th century, Albert Einstein and Jean Perrin investigated Brownian motion. Einstein developed a mathematical model, then Perrin proved that Einstein was right in some experiments. This third form of evidence was enough to convince the doubters that yeah atoms and molecules are the truth of reality.

Is my narrative correct? Am I missing anything?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

How did the Byzantine Empire react to Charlemagne being crowned "Emperor of the Romans"?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

Were there divisions of labor before Industrial revolution?

context: I was watching this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6UXRZ2XwgU

And it is said there that each household were pretty much self-sufficient, and society didn't have the opportunity to do division of labor.

2 Answers 2020-09-10

How did both Nazi Germany and the United States come to be working on an atomic bomb project at the same time? How similar were the goals of their respective programs?

I've been watching Manhattan the last few days (a great show even if a little inaccurate in points) and one of the background plot points is that it's a race to develop an atomic bomb before the Nazis can do so.

While I understand that the US was the only country to devote substantial resources to the task, how is it that both countries came to be developing a previously unheard-of superbomb at the same time?

Did the concept of an atomic bomb exist beforehand and both countries already dabbled in the idea but the war just accelerated things? This seems logical but as far as I can tell no one publicly guessed that such a thing might be in the works, and if the concept existed I would think there would have been calls for it to be made into a reality (by those who didn't know it already was in the works).

Was the Nazi atomic bomb program substantially similar in its end goal? Would they have arrived at essentially the same bomb the Americans built, given the time and resources to conclude their program?

Did any other countries have a program in the works during the war?

2 Answers 2020-09-10

What did Qin Shi Huang do differently military wise that allowed him to unify China?

It’s often said that he did something no one else for centuries and that he was able to unify China. He was able to conquer multiple warring states. But what did he do differently that allowed him to do it that others before him couldn’t? Was it news military tactics never used before? Was it new weapons technology that was more advanced than their enemies? What were the reasons?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

What is court?

I'be been binge watching some history videos and I love it. I keep hearing the word "Court" all over again in every video. I thought it was court, like courtroom but no! I was wrong! When I searched up French court, It just shows the palace of Versailles. What is court?No, not the courtroom, Royals in court! What is court?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

When did the things USA (and similar cultures) considers normal (assembly line, corporatism, planned obsolescence, public education...) develop and who participated in the conversation?

Over the years I've heard little snippets that have stuck with me such as:

Henry Ford invented the assembly line. The Nazis loved corporatism, they privatized tons of things. The Robber Barons invented planned obsolescence. America follows the Prussian model of education.

But I don't know if these statements are true, or over simplified. It's taken 35 years, but I'm starting to get curious about how everything fits together and how today emerged from yesterday.

1 Answers 2020-09-10

What was up with the Roman Pantheon?

It's sort of weird right? The idea that it was a temple to all the gods doesn't make much sense, given what I know of Roman religion. What is known of its early use and meaning? What is known or surmised of Agrippa's intent for the original building? What is known of the meaning Hadrian's restoration, that still stands, may have had? Was it even a temple? The dome seems to be intended to be seen, but afaik Roman religion generally didn't have people visit the cella. Was there ever an altar or sacred enclosure associated with the building?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

What were Frederick II. Of Sicily's views on Byzantium, aka the Eastern Roman Empire, since he contributed to the later Italian renaissance and emulated classical Roman Emperors?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

What ethnicity were the anatolian byzantines before being conquested by the ottomans?

I have been searching for the language the anatolians spoke and what ethnicity they were,but until now I have not been able to find anything.Any information would be deeply appreciated

1 Answers 2020-09-10

What were the factors behind Carthage's notably poor military leadership compared with other great ancient powers?

Carthage constantly was at war for nearly 200 years between the Sicilian wars and the end of the Mercenary war and they continued to show a surprising level of amateurism in their military leadership despite several heavy defeats in this period. This was not for lack of trying as they brought in new innovations such as war elephants and and box compartments in their ships.

Other peer powers such as major Greek states, the Romans and the Persians were able to learn from their leadership mistakes but the Carthaginians seemed unable to change their approach. Why?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

What was the Ottoman Parliament, that was established after the Young Turks revolution of 1908? What was it's powers and what did it managed to achieve?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

I'm a British naval captain from anywhere between 1700-1815. How absolute is my power? If I order a man to be flogged repeatedly, or order an execution for a minor infraction, is that allowed? If not, how are the rules prohibiting extreme punishment enforced?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

Why weren't grenades commonly used in combat in the era of the American Revolution?

I have seen artwork depicting battles from the Late Medieval/Early Modern period where early grenades were used, but I remember reading that the British Grenadiers of the American Revolution had retained the name but had phased out the use of grenades. However, a few generations later, they had become common in infantry combat once again, and are still with us today.

Were grenades used by either side of the Revolutionary War? If not, why had lost their tactical value?

This question was inspired by this image of a grenade launcher from the previous century, posted in Artefact Porn!

1 Answers 2020-09-10

George Orwell, an Englishman, once said that the "rifle on the wall of the labourer’s cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there." Was gun ownership once widespread among commoners in the UK, as in the US?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

Why did Carthage's reliance on mercenaries loyal to their commanders, not lead to their generals marching against Carthage like what would eventually happen later to the Roman Republic?

What was actually stopping Hamiclar or Hannibal Barca from taking their army and overthrowing the republic in Carthage?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

Are there any documented methods by which the pyramids were built?

I presume they had large contraptions for building them, and was wondering if the primitive equipment had any diagrams reported anywhere.

1 Answers 2020-09-10

Why is the reverse cross used as means of Satanism or evil against god?

I did some research about this but i couldn't find anything other than why pop culture made it popular. So here's my question why is the cross reversed reference evil and is there anything similar in history about this that could be taken as reference from what the horror movies are doing?

1 Answers 2020-09-10

Would a sculpture depicting a historical event that was made and displayed decades later be considered a secondary source? Can artwork even be considered a secondary source depending on the artist/time?

I'm a bit confused because primary sources include artwork, but this is a piece of work was created nearly 40 years after the events that the statue depicts. I feel like this would be a secondary source because of the fact that it wasn't created by an eyewitness of the event/during the time period of the event. However, when I look at examples of secondary sources, I don't see anything that includes art work, so I am very conflicted as to what this would be considered as. I'm really leaning towards secondary but I am unsure to say that with 100% certainty, so I am looking for some insight from this community. Thank you!

2 Answers 2020-09-10

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